Settings - paths - improve grouping

[user0]

XnViewMP 1.7.1 64bit
Windows11 (23H2), display resolution 3840x2160, win scaling 150%

Startup Wizard / Settings - integration - paths
settings grouping is not ideal

Suggestion

settings_paths.png

• rework
  • radiobutton into item in the 'Main settings' combobox
    so it's easier to remove win option on other target systems and settings will be more universal
  • 'open location' buttons into button with icon, eg unicode:
    (U+1F4C1) File Folder
    (U+1F4C2) Open File Folder
    🗁 (U+1F5C1) Open Folder

• rename
  - Program (XnView) → Application folder
  - User (System) → System - user folder
  - (maybe) Same as Catalog → Application folder
  as using different names for the same result in one dialog does not look nice

• Startup Wizard
  - (maybe) move context menu integration below Settings location groups

Related

• suggestions
  Settings - paths - improve grouping (current post)
  Need to change the location of settings

[cicciobello]

Good idea! (As almost always, user0!)

[xnview]

See issue for current status and some details.

[B.Douille]

Startup Wizard / Settings - integration - paths settings grouping is not ideal

Hi, I agree all the current settings are not obvious and there is an opportunity to improve.
Can you explain the idea behind the application settings being split in "Main" and "Other" ?

So far there was 3 options for the application itself and 3 options for each of the 3 storage items, making 12 combinations
- Your proposal consolidate 2 storage locations out of 3. These items are heritages from the Classic version and personally I'm happy with the default, I don't touch these. That's ok for me and believe it's ok for most users.
- Integrating the option "Use the registry" into the options for the application settings looks good* but the new option I requested add one more. On top of this, adding here another item "Other" increase the total number of combination This means even more complexity for an average user while the current tendency is to make user's life easier.

I suggest we find ways to simplify, reduce the number of combinations, based on type of deployment:
1- Install for a single user on a machine, using the setup. All configuration files, database,... are located in the user folder (same as for now)
2- Install for a group of user sharing the same collection of pictures/videos, using setup. Same as above except the files are located in a folder accessible r/w for all users of the machine (the change ongoing)
3- Install on a mobile device (USB key or external HDD) using ZIP'ed to be used on various machine while travelling. All files are stored at the same place as the binary files. This is similar to the current "Application folder" option except this becomes the default when packaged in a ZIP.

[xnview]

Something like that

Clipboard-1.jpg

If you choose custom, you can set like now

[user0]

Some thing like that
If you choose custom, you can set like now

looks good

Can you explain the idea behind the application settings being split in "Main" and "Other" ?

naming can be different (eg General, Global, etc.), but imo better to follow Primary/Secondary pattern

• Main
  xnview.ini (can be loaded via command line from different location)

• Other
  presets, toolbars, shortcuts, layout, autocorrect, tagface_history, batch_convert_log, etc.

So far there was 3 options for the application itself and 3 options for each of the 3 storage items, making 12 combinations
- Your proposal consolidate 2 storage locations out of 3. These items are heritages from the Classic version and personally I'm happy with the default, I don't touch these. That's ok for me and believe it's ok for most users.
- Integrating the option "Use the registry" into the options for the application settings looks good* but the new option I requested add one more. On top of this, adding here another item "Other" increase the total number of combination This means even more complexity for an average user while the current tendency is to make user's life easier.

there are same 4 comboboxes

[B.Douille]

If you choose custom, you can set like now

Do you mean all other items are greyed unless you choose Custom ?
That's good, no headache for average users. Complexity left behind the scene

Is there a real need for a "Portable" option ? I think this is all solved by the ZIPped version. For those using this method of deployment the other options are good enough, I think. If you use the setup program, such option may lead to confusion as the binaries would not be installed on a removable drive, right ?

Naming can be different (eg General, Global, etc.)

Ok that's what I though. A split between settings that are very personal as I use the application and on the other side, those settings impacting processing.
That's interesting in the context of a Shared configuration :
- The "General settings" are saved in the %ProgramData% location (and equivalent for Mac and Linux). This ensure consistent processing for all users (for example saving files while keeping the original attributes)
- The "Individual - per user settings" are saved in the user's profile %AppData% (as per the single user configuration). It contains my preferences for presets, toolbars, shortcuts, layout, autocorrect, tagface_history, batch_convert_log, etc.

@Pierre if not included in your planned changes already, can we exploit this split for the Shared ?

For the naming of the options I suggest "Single user" ("Moi seul") vs "All Users" ("Tous les utilisateurs").
See below sample I saw recently for another application:

Install for all or just for me.jpg

[xnview]

Is there a real need for a "Portable" option ? I think this is all solved by the ZIPped version. For those using this method of deployment the other options are good enough, I think. If you use the setup program, such option may lead to confusion as the binaries would not be installed on a removable drive, right ?

In ZIP package, there is no ini, so you need to set it

@Pierre if not included in your planned changes already, can we exploit this split for the Shared ?

Do you means that 'All users' configuration must use 'All users' for General/Catalog/Thumbnails and 'Single user' for 'Other'?

[B.Douille]

In ZIP package, there is no ini, so you need to set it

Can we add one in the distribution? If someone wants his own configuration he already has a copy of the files for his needs (and he knows how to copy /would fine How to in the forum).

@Pierre if not included in your planned changes already, can we exploit this split for the Shared ?

Do you means that 'All users' configuration must use 'All users' for General/Catalog/Thumbnails and 'Single user' for 'Other'?

Yes

[user0]

In ZIP package, there is no ini, so you need to set it

Can we add one in the distribution? If someone wants his own configuration he already has a copy of the files for his needs (and he knows how to copy /would fine How to in the forum).

Archive should not contain user settings, as its content unzips into an existing folder, overwriting everything in it.

@Pierre if not included in your planned changes already, can we exploit this split for the Shared ?

Do you means that 'All users' configuration must use 'All users' for General/Catalog/Thumbnails and 'Single user' for 'Other'?

Yes

I disagree
Current user - means use current user profile folder for EVERYTHING
All users - means use shared folder for EVERYTHING
Custom - user do whatever user wants (your case)

[B.Douille]

Reminder the goal of this topic (you created) is to improve grouping of settings, aka simplify.

Archive should not contain user settings, as its content unzips into an existing folder, overwriting everything in it.

Overwriting doesn't look like IT best practice... No backup, no wayback, increased risk of instability due to mix-up of files from different versions. I proceed more safely and I hope, I guess majority of people do so as well. PM please, if you want to discuss method.
Deployment via a ZIP archive can use any of the options, depending on the use. However the option "Portable" should not be used in the context of standard installation. The impact is unknown. That's why I suggested to include the configuration file. We should find a way forward.

I disagree
All users - means use shared folder for EVERYTHING

Interesting to understand why, what's the problem ? We have an opportunity to improve user's experience. The shared configuration is new or re-new should I say so I do not see how the way files are stored in this configuration impacts the way sou are using the application. PM please.

[xnview]

In ZIP package, there is no ini, so you need to set it

Can we add one in the distribution? If someone wants his own configuration he already has a copy of the files for his needs (and he knows how to copy /would fine How to in the forum).

we cant, many users use ZIP package and user settings

@Pierre if not included in your planned changes already, can we exploit this split for the Shared ?

Do you means that 'All users' configuration must use 'All users' for General/Catalog/Thumbnails and 'Single user' for 'Other'?

Yes

i agree that 'All users - means use shared folder for EVERYTHING', it's strange to use 'all users' configuration and have a mix

[B.Douille]

we cant, many users use ZIP package and user settings

From day one I used the ZIP files for XnView on an USB key and on my desktop at least in the past (8 ?) years due to the issue with the location of settings. I can't believe so many people just copy over and don't save their precious personal data beforehand.
This said, no pb for me. It's no more my main concern

it's strange to use 'all users' configuration and have a mix

Not that strange. For Windows have a look at folders refered the environnement variables (you can cut/pastel in the adress bar of Explorer) :
%ProgramData% (shared contents, settings of the application that are pre-fixed by développers and administrators of the machine(s) and can be adapted by users),
%AppData% (individual users content and settings for the application that - if needs can be stored on net to ease mobility - roaming),
%LocalAppData% (individual users contents - cache that are always stored locally). In each folders you'll find sub-folders for each application installed / used.
The same apply for unix, Linux, Mac but I don't have the détails in mind. So, having part of the settings split is normal and is transparent for the users, still providing them some ability to personnalise without impacting the main feature, the behaviour still consistent accross all users.
This said, here again, I'm already happy with the new setup that include a multi-user mode (XnView will have it's folder in %ProgramData% ) and if you don't implement split config by default, the custom mode would allow administrators to make it.

[B.Douille]

Hello,
Checking with older versions I found the "Settings - Other" exist for long. I just ignored it so far because what it change wasn't obvious.

Now I know what's behind. It define the location of configuration files that define customised Toolbar, keyboard shortcuts, saved layouts A-D). All these are part of customisations that a user can make on the appearance of his application.
Personally I made few of such changes and still have them thanks to backups but if I want to have the same look with my portable USB I now how to transfer them.

Maybe a good idea to make it more obvious, rename like Personal settings vs General settings