File Inclusion/Exclusion

Ideas for improvements and requests for new features in XnView Classic

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Olivier_G
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Post by Olivier_G » Fri Oct 14, 2005 12:14 pm

xnview wrote:I think that having "open action" on the same panel is not so good... Not enough space...
I agree that it looks a bit "tight" on the previous picture. :?

But it is quite convenient to get the whole picture on this single panel: you can easily decide how to handle files at all stage within XnView.
Moreover, moving "open with" elsewhere would require a lot of space again (a full panel?).

Maybe we can get a better looking layout by:
- reducing the 'Open with' column width to allow more space, by using "Default" instead of "Associated program"
- merging Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' into a single 'Thumbnail view' and using droplists with "Show"/"List only"/"Hide" instead of checkboxes
- moving "if smaller than . KB" line somewhere else
...

Opinions on those possible improvements?

Olivier

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Post by raga » Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:09 am

Olivier_G wrote: I agree that it looks a bit "tight" on the previous picture.
It will even get tighter if you include one more column for Navigation, as it was included in Pierre's original proposal. ;)

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Post by Olivier_G » Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:05 am

raga wrote:It will even get tighter if you include one more column for Navigation, as it was included in Pierre's original proposal. ;)
:?
True... although I believed the latest 'feeling' was that 'Open with' settings would influence directly 'Navigation' (ie: only show items with 'XnView', skip others in navigation).

Question: would it be useful to be able to choose 'Open with' and 'Navigation' independently?
(an example: "I want to open a video/audio in XnView from Browser, but I don't want to run videos/audios while navigating in view mode")
:?:
(methinks: "yes"... :| )


Another question: is 'Other Views' custom settings really useful ?
-> there is no performance issue, and I believe most (all?) people tend to show everything in those views [except maybe: folders and parent folder]
-> you can already quickly filter with Menu>View>'Filter by' when you need it (categories: Image/Video/Sound/Archive/All)
:?:

Olivier

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Post by Dreamer » Sat Oct 15, 2005 2:54 pm

Olivier_G wrote:Image
I like this "all in one" solution, nice, clean, [v] = include, no confusion about include/exclude.

We need even more space for other languages, but I think it's the best solution.
Maybe we can get a better looking layout by:
1 - reducing the 'Open with' column width to allow more space, by using "Default" instead of "Associated program"
2 - merging Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' into a single 'Thumbnail view' and using droplists with "Show"/"List only"/"Hide" instead of checkboxes
3 - moving "if smaller than . KB" line somewhere else
1 - Yes, we could add "Open with program:" and then just "Default" / "XnView" (/ "None")

2 - I disagree, rather move "Open with" - Edit - I agree (more below)

3 - We still need more space for other languages (for "list" and "create"), so I don't think it would help much, but what about this:

If smalles than [...] [...] - [...] .KB

I think there should be also option for PDF... files and also "Custom files", maybe like this:

Code: Select all

PDF,EPS,PS files     [v]  [ ]  [v]  [ ]
[abc,def ] files     [v]  [ ]  [ ]  [v]
BTW - I think we need similar "File Handling" page for View / Fullscreen mode, I'll start a new topic (link).
Last edited by Dreamer on Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:39 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Post by Olivier_G » Sat Oct 15, 2005 3:22 pm

Dreamer wrote:
2 - merging Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' into a single 'Thumbnail view' and using droplists with "Show"/"List only"/"Hide" instead of checkboxes
2 - I disagree
I prefer the single droplist solution (vs 2 separate columns) because:
- you consider it as a single item, which may avoid some confusion
- 'Show'/'List only'/'Hide' is pretty much easy to understand
- it should save some space... :P
- no need to handle the relationship (ie: if 'list' is not selected -> grey out 'create')
Dreamer wrote:BTW - I think we need similar "File Handling" page for View / Fullscreen mode, I'll start a new topic (link (soon)).
Isn't that the same as the 'navigation' issue stated previously? :?:

Olivier

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Post by Dreamer » Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:33 pm

Olivier_G wrote:
Dreamer wrote:
2 - merging Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' into a single 'Thumbnail view' and using droplists with "Show"/"List only"/"Hide" instead of checkboxes
2 - I disagree
I prefer the single droplist solution (vs 2 separate columns) because:
- you consider it as a single item, which may avoid some confusion
- 'Show'/'List only'/'Hide' is pretty much easy to understand
- it should save some space... :P
- no need to handle the relationship (ie: if 'list' is not selected -> grey out 'create')
OK, I misunderstood. You mean, use [Show/List only/Hide] instead of checkboxes [v], right? Then it's quite good solution, just a bit inconsistent to other columns, but I think it's OK.
Olivier_G wrote:
Dreamer wrote:BTW - I think we need similar "File Handling" page for View / Fullscreen mode, I'll start a new topic (link (soon)).
Isn't that the same as the 'navigation' issue stated previously?
Sorry, could you explain?

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Post by Olivier_G » Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:59 pm

Dreamer wrote:
Olivier_G wrote:
Dreamer wrote:I think we need similar "File Handling" page for View / Fullscreen mode, I'll start a new topic (link (soon)).[/i]
Isn't that the same as the 'navigation' issue stated previously?
Sorry, could you explain?
Raga reminded us that 'navigation'/'View' was suggested in this very thread... which is how to handle file when viewing them (=> which types to show/filter in view/full-screen - especially when you navigate with 'Previous'/'Next').
And this is why I also asked:
would it be useful to be able to choose 'Open with' and 'Navigation' independently? (methinks: "yes"... :| )
=> I was on the way to reduce some columns (gather Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' under a single item, wonder about 'Other Views', reduce 'Open with', etc...) in order to add a new column for 'Navigation'/'View'. It might be redundant with your suggestion...

Olivier

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Post by Olivier_G » Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:06 pm

Oh oh... another great improvement to come... :D
From the other thread:
Dreamer wrote:
helmut wrote:In the above drafts we have "Open in XnView", "Open in Associated Program", and "No action". I wonder whether "No action" is really needed.
I don't need it.
I don't need it either, and, actually, I don't see why anyone would double-click/Enter on something... to get nothing???
-> It would mean that the droplists could be replaced by just an 'Open in XnView' column with checkboxes instead.

I'll try to come with an updated picture to show all this (except if someone comes with other ideas :) ).

Olivier
PS: by the way, what font is used in XnView option panels? (I use something else for my changes, and it shows... :( )

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Post by Dreamer » Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:39 pm

Olivier_G wrote:...=> I was on the way to reduce some columns (gather Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' under a single item, wonder about 'Other Views', reduce 'Open with', etc...) in order to add a new column for 'Navigation'/'View'. It might be redundant with your suggestion...
I think, with 2 more columns (View/FS mode), it would be extremely tight and confusing.

My solution means:

Add all options from Browser mode to one options page (this thread - preview/thumnbails/other views/open with).

And add all options from View/Fullscreen mode to another options page (this topic - view/fullscreen mode)
I'll try to come with an updated picture to show all this
OK, you can try, but there would be too many checkboxes, so I think it would be confusing... Also - we don't need "archives", "folders", "[..]" for View/FS but we need another options for it, more in "my" new topic.

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Post by helmut » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:16 pm

Olivier_G wrote:
xnview wrote:I think that having "open action" on the same panel is not so good... Not enough space...
I agree that it looks a bit "tight" on the previous picture. :?
...
Sorry for joining the discussion so late. The option dialog designed by you (Olivier) is o.k., but I think it will be impossible to find good and short translations. E.g. "Associated program" is "Verknüpftes Programm" in German, translations in other languages might be a bit shorter or even longer.
Olivier_G wrote:But it is quite convenient to get the whole picture on this single panel: you can easily decide how to handle files at all stage within XnView.
Moreover, moving "open with" elsewhere would require a lot of space again (a full panel?).
Fully agree here.
Olivier_G wrote:Mabe we can get a better looking layout by:
- reducing the 'Open with' column width to allow more space, by using "Default" instead of "Associated program"
- merging Thumbnail 'list' and 'create' into a single 'Thumbnail view' and using droplists with "Show"/"List only"/"Hide" instead of checkboxes
- moving "if smaller than . KB" line somewhere else
...

Opinions on those possible improvements?
Have to have a closer look and think about it...

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helmut
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Post by helmut » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:17 pm

raga wrote:
Olivier_G wrote: I agree that it looks a bit "tight" on the previous picture.
It will even get tighter if you include one more column for Navigation, as it was included in Pierre's original proposal. ;)
It's true, at some stage there was the idea to have a filter that affects navigation (Previous/Next image) in View mode. But some XnView versions ago, we had different file lists for browser and viewer and it was very confusing. This should not be re-introduced.

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Post by helmut » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:23 pm

Olivier_G wrote:Oh oh... another great improvement to come... :D
From the other thread:
Dreamer wrote:
helmut wrote:In the above drafts we have "Open in XnView", "Open in Associated Program", and "No action". I wonder whether "No action" is really needed.
I don't need it.
I don't need it either, and, actually, I don't see why anyone would double-click/Enter on something... to get nothing???
-> It would mean that the droplists could be replaced by just an 'Open in XnView' column with checkboxes instead.
A checkbox might save some space, but a checkbox won't work well here since the opposite of "Open in XnView" is "Do not open in XnView" (when it should actually say "Open in associated program").
Olivier_G wrote:...
PS: by the way, what font is used in XnView option panels? (I use something else for my changes, and it shows... :( )
On Windows XP the default font is Tahoma 8. I've been using MS Sans Serif 8 in my above screens.

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Post by helmut » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:37 pm

Olivier_G wrote:...
Question: would it be useful to be able to choose 'Open with' and 'Navigation' independently?
(an example: "I want to open a video/audio in XnView from Browser, but I don't want to run videos/audios while navigating in view mode")
:?:
(methinks: "yes"... :| )
'Open with' is related to 'Navigation', but like you I think it should be settable independantly.
Olivier_G wrote:Another question: is 'Other Views' custom settings really useful ?
I've posed this question (somewhere in this thread or the "Open associated file" thread, and Pierre wrote that "Other views" was really needed.
Olivier_G wrote:-> there is no performance issue, and I believe most (all?) people tend to show everything in those views [except maybe: folders and parent folder]
True. But obviously not all people.
Olivier_G wrote:-> you can already quickly filter with Menu>View>'Filter by' when you need it (categories: Image/Video/Sound/Archive/All)
:?:
It's true that filters could be adjusted manually, if needed. But sure enough an automatic adjust when switchting the type of view is more convenient (given that different filters are needed).

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Post by Olivier_G » Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:42 am

Latest artwork from me... :wink: ...with all useful settings ('Navigate(View)' applies to both 'Viewer' AND 'Full-Screen' as I don't think that separate settings is really needed)

Image

I haven't decided on Inclusion/Exclusion yet (my text boxes are very flexible, Dreamer's latest 'Custom' group looks great).
They both would fit.

What is your opinion?

Olivier

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Post by Olivier_G » Mon Oct 17, 2005 12:47 pm

Small update...

I have put "Open with program" and droplists because it is self-explanatory as Helmut explained... however, it may still be better to use "Open in XnView*"+check-boxes instead, with a *foot-note saying "else: opened with associated program" -> It would look cleaner and more consistent.

Maybe 'Text files' and 'pdf,eps,pd files' should be gathered under a single item 'Document files' (which may include doc, xls, ppt... in the future if someone request that), as this level of detail is probably not needed in an Image Viewer program.

In "Navigate": 'Folders' and 'Parent folder' should be available (if checked, it would show the generic icon, and double-click/Enter would select it -> you would be able to move within folders while staying in View mode)

'Thumbnail' droplists would be specific to the item. Example:
- Images, Video, Documents => Show/List/Hide
- Audio, Archives, Parent folder => List/Hide
- Folders => 'Show 4 thumbnails'/List/Hide
(it could even be possible to consider more options here, but it would have to be consistent and simple)

Olivier

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