Wrong color profile conversion when saving a photo which has ICC profile

[AndreasW]

I've also just come across this problem myself. Frankly, with all due respect, it's beyond me how such a fundamental problem can be ignored by the developer for more than two years. This disqualifies XnViewMP for any serious use. The fact that it's free for private use doesn't make it any better. Sorry, just my two cents.

[xnview]

I've also just come across this problem myself. Frankly, with all due respect, it's beyond me how such a fundamental problem can be ignored by the developer for more than two years. This disqualifies XnViewMP for any serious use. The fact that it's free for private use doesn't make it any better. Sorry, just my two cents.

It was not easy to fix this problem, many changes in the paint engine...

Thanks to your detailed description I can reproduce the problem.

[xnview]

This problem is supposed to be fixed in XnView MP 1.5.0 beta. Please check and confirm the bug fix here.

[AndreasW]

This problem is supposed to be fixed in XnView MP 1.5.0 beta. Please check and confirm the bug fix here.

I would like to test it, but unfortunately there seems to be only a Windows version available for download. I'd need a macOS version.

[xnview]

This problem is supposed to be fixed in XnView MP 1.5.0 beta. Please check and confirm the bug fix here.

I would like to test it, but unfortunately there seems to be only a Windows version available for download. I'd need a macOS version.

The MacOS beta 1 is available now

[AndreasW]

Thanks, but I need a version for Intel processors. Sorry that I forgot to mention this.

[AndreasW]

Okay, I installed the beta on my wife's Mac, which has an M1 processor. Here's my feedback:

1. The download says "beta 1", but the menu bar of the program itself says "beta 2" ==> not a real issue, I just wanted to mention it.

2. The menu "Color Profile" has not changed at all, which is surprising (to me), since you wrote that you made many changes. I would have expected the entry "user-defined" to be removed. I would have expected that XnView automatically, autonomously detects the monitor profile and applies it. That's what other viewers do, for example Apple's preview.

3. As long as the entry "user-defined" is empty, XnView displays images with wrong colors ==> no surprise.

4. When I enter my Mac's monitor profile under "user-defined", XnView displays a completely white image ==> bug! In the previous, stable version, XnView displayed the image with correct colors.

5. I didn't test what happens when I make a change to the image and save it with "save as". Such testing makes no sense as long as the bug (4) exists.

[bodayw]

This problem is supposed to be fixed in XnView MP 1.5.0 beta. Please check and confirm the bug fix here.

Really appreciate your time and effort for fixing this issue.

However, it seems the issue persists on my end with 1.5.0 beta 1: as I described earlier, "save as" an open image with ICC color management enabled still produced a color-shifted image.

Aaand it actually got worse (oops): now with 1.5.0 beta 1, the "batch convert" tool also has the same issue, with the same color shift, so we no longer have a workaround...I'm sure this is unintentional, though.

(just to make sure I've done the test correctly: I only need to unzip the beta release and run the xnviewmp.exe, right? Although it seems like it automatically picked up my configuration from the installed (stable) version (xnview.ini in the system user directory, I guess) so I didn't need to re-configure it, but I don't think I need to uninstall the stable version for this test.)

To reiterate:

- when "save as" an image, with or without an ICC profile embedded, the data values representing colors in the original image should not change in any way (unless, of course, the user explicitly modified them);

- with color management enabled, XnView MP displays images with colors converted according to the embedded ICC profile (if there is one) and the monitor ICC profile, making the color to look correctly on the current monitor, which is all good;

- however, when "save as" the image, XnView MP takes the color-converted image data from above as is, while it should take the original image data from the source file, that is, before the color conversion;

- in the current stable release, the "batch convert" tool doesn't have this issue, but in 1.5.0 beta 1 it now also have the same issue.

[bodayw]

Okay, I installed the beta on my wife's Mac, which has an M1 processor. Here's my feedback:

1. The download says "beta 1", but the menu bar of the program itself says "beta 2" ==> not a real issue, I just wanted to mention it.

2. The menu "Color Profile" has not changed at all, which is surprising (to me), since you wrote that you made many changes. I would have expected the entry "user-defined" to be removed. I would have expected that XnView automatically, autonomously detects the monitor profile and applies it. That's what other viewers do, for example Apple's preview.

3. As long as the entry "user-defined" is empty, XnView displays images with wrong colors ==> no surprise.

4. When I enter my Mac's monitor profile under "user-defined", XnView displays a completely white image ==> bug! In the previous, stable version, XnView displayed the image with correct colors.

5. I didn't test what happens when I make a change to the image and save it with "save as". Such testing makes no sense as long as the bug (4) exists.

> The menu "Color Profile" has not changed at all

Are you referring to Settings - General - ICC - Use ICC profile for monitor? If so,

> I would have expected the entry "user-defined" to be removed.

Why would it to be removed? I think it just gives the user another way to change the ICC profile they want to use, maybe temporarily a different one than the one set in system settings.

> I would have expected that XnView automatically, autonomously detects the monitor profile and applies it.

Probably for performance concerns XnView never enables color management by default. But it's still easy to enable it, and you only need to select "System" and it will automatically use the one specified in the system settings (you can verify by checking the path shown on the right).

I don't have a Mac at hand for a couple of years now, so I might be wrong, but in my memory it has always been the same on Windows and macOS.

> XnView displays a completely white image

Now that is not good indeed...

[AndreasW]

I was referring to the whole tab "Settings - General - ICC". It has not changed at all.

In particular, I would have expected the entry "Custom" to be removed. (In my previous posting, I mistakenly called this entry "user-defined". That's because I was using the German interface, and I did my own, incorrect translation into English.) In my opinion, this entry is useless. Why would any user want to enter a profile other than the monitor profile here? I can see no use for that. And I don't know of any other viewer software that supports this. If this were useful, other viewers would also support it. I also don't think it makes much sense to turn off color management completely just to save a few milliseconds when loading an image. The penalty for doing so (namely wrong colors) is simply too high.

bodayw, could you please explain in more detail where exactly the user can select "System" to have XnView use the system's monitor profile?

[bodayw]

I was referring to the whole tab "Settings - General - ICC". It has not changed at all.

In particular, I would have expected the entry "Custom" to be removed. (In my previous posting, I mistakenly called this entry "user-defined". That's because I was using the German interface, and I did my own, incorrect translation into English.) In my opinion, this entry is useless. Why would any user want to enter a profile other than the monitor profile here? I can see no use for that. And I don't know of any other viewer software that supports this. If this were useful, other viewers would also support it. I also don't think it makes much sense to turn off color management completely just to save a few milliseconds when loading an image. The penalty for doing so (namely wrong colors) is simply too high.

bodayw, could you please explain in more detail where exactly the user can select "System" to have XnView use the system's monitor profile?

> Why would any user want to enter a profile other than the monitor profile here

One circumstance I can think of in which this could be useful is that, a user might need to temporarily use a specific monitor ICC profile for testing purposes, and it's just "temporarily" enough that one might not want to install it into the system? Or someone may have multiple ICC profiles for different monitor configurations (e.g. targeting different white points) and/or workflows - and sometimes one might want to limit this change within XnView while not affecting other apps.

I think it doesn't hurt to give more options for the users, so long as there is a quick and easy way to select the one specified in the system settings (see below).

> I also don't think it makes much sense to turn off color management completely just to save a few milliseconds when loading an image

Well, the reality is that majority of users never care about color consistency i.e. color management...Many programs, even enthusiasts-oriented ones like mpv and madVR, don't enable color management by default, although, yeah, performance concerns are indeed more relevant for video players.

I was only speculating when I said "performance concerns", as Pierre explicitly put "(slower)" there with the "Use ICC profile for monitor" option.

> could you please explain in more detail where exactly the user can select "System" to have XnView use the system's monitor profile?

Under Settings - General - ICC, after enabling "Use ICC profile for monitor (slower)", the first block underneath should have two options, namely "System" and "Custom" - choosing the first one should automatically set the system one, showing its path on the right, while choosing "Custom" would allow for manual selection.

This is what I have on Windows, and IIRC it should be the same on the Mac version, but I could be wrong given I haven't use a Mac in the last couple of years.

[AndreasW]

Here's a screenshot of that dialog on my wife's Mac. There's no option "System" that could be selected. To turn on proper color management, users must know the full path of their monitor's ICC file, navigate to it, and select it, which is cumbersome, error-prone, and not user-friendly. I had expected an improvement here.

[bodayw]

Here's a screenshot of that dialog on my wife's Mac. There's no option "System" that could be selected. To turn on proper color management, users must know the full path of their monitor's ICC file, navigate to it, and select it, which is cumbersome, error-prone, and not user-friendly. I had expected an improvement here.

Oh, I see. Your complaint makes much sense to me now. I definitely think there should be a way to quickly select the system profile.

Could be a bug in Mac's build?

[xnview]

2. The menu "Color Profile" has not changed at all, which is surprising (to me), since you wrote that you made many changes. I would have expected the entry "user-defined" to be removed. I would have expected that XnView automatically, autonomously detects the monitor profile and applies it. That's what other viewers do, for example Apple's preview.

It will be changed in b2

4. When I enter my Mac's monitor profile under "user-defined", XnView displays a completely white image ==> bug! In the previous, stable version, XnView displayed the image with correct colors.

An issue on MacOS

5. I didn't test what happens when I make a change to the image and save it with "save as". Such testing makes no sense as long as the bug (4) exists.

It should work...

[xnview]

- when "save as" an image, with or without an ICC profile embedded, the data values representing colors in the original image should not change in any way (unless, of course, the user explicitly modified them);

- however, when "save as" the image, XnView MP takes the color-converted image data from above as is, while it should take the original image data from the source file, that is, before the color conversion;

- in the current stable release, the "batch convert" tool doesn't have this issue, but in 1.5.0 beta 1 it now also have the same issue.

It's like that in 1.5.0 beta 1, the saved image keep original image data. you are on Windows? How to reproduce?