Improve Tag function

Ideas for improvements and requests for new features in XnView Classic

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pic_viewer
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Improve Tag function

Post by pic_viewer » Sat Jan 05, 2008 8:25 pm

Hello,

I tried to use the tag function and think it can be improved a lot with two small changes/additions:

- Tags should not get lost when changing to a different directory. They should at least survive the current session. Example: you want to tag files in lots of different folders for a move or copy action to a new directory. It is cumbersome to copy/move the files each time you leave the current folder. It would be much easier if you need to do this only once.

- The current View/Tag menu lists three actions:
Tag current (Ctrl-t)
Untag current
Invert (Ctrl-t)

IMHO this is not the best way to do it. It should list

Tag / Untag / Invert (Ctrl-T, though I prefer Space)
Untag all

You can tag single files, consecutive files as well as free multiple selections, so 'current' is an obsolete description that just confuses the user.

The function 'Untag all' is simply missing at this time (yes, I can change the folder for a second to do this, but hopefully this will change soon ;-)

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Dreamer
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Post by Dreamer » Sat Jan 05, 2008 10:33 pm

Another minor suggestion:

- Option to go to the next item after selecting(tagging) (to quickly tag more items)
Dreamer

jotess
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Re: Improve Tag function

Post by jotess » Thu Jan 10, 2008 2:41 pm

pic_viewer wrote: - Tags should not get lost when changing to a different directory. They should at least survive the current session.
Yes, at least!
Actually the fact that tags don't persist through changes of folders renders the whole feature useless to me.

regards
Joachim

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JohnFredC
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Post by JohnFredC » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:33 pm

Yes, non-persistent tags are an issue in many softwares that support file tagging. Tagging is a separate concept from selection.

In XnView, we need options to control when tags persist and when they are cleared, based on user-defined conditions. Circumstances that might apply such "persist tags"/"clear tags" rules could be:

- After batch convert
- After batch rename
- After copy/move (tags persist or not at destination)
- On exit folder

Once we have persistent tags, we'll need a "clear all tags", "clear all tags in folder", "clear all tags in folder tree" , etc.

Furthermore, we need a method to tag folders.

I also conceive of a dynamic tagging/category interaction that allows the user to link a category to a tagging checkbox that appears directly on the thumb.

And yes, one can already use categories to perform the same functionality as persistent tags, but IMHO XnView's Category (and Rating) implementation is cumbersome and inconvenient to use. I'd much prefer just to click directly on controls displayed in the thumbnails...

XnView is so excellent already, it makes one think how to use it even more effectively.
John

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Post by fbachofner » Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:37 am

I agree with these comments and forwarded the same to the author maybe 2 years ago.

A fairly good tagging system (used to be, at least) implemented in Polyview, a competitive image management program (see www.polybytes.com).

Polyview 3.x allowed tagging of files from multiple locations and actually placed these in a virtual folder which then allowed the files to be reviewed, removed from the tag list and even deleted from the original source location.

This is the ONLY feature I ever missed from Polyview since adopting XNView . . .

If XNView adopted a similar method of dealing with tags, it would be the perfect image management solution!

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Post by xnview » Tue Feb 19, 2008 1:57 pm

JohnFredC wrote: In XnView, we need options to control when tags persist and when they are cleared, based on user-defined conditions. Circumstances that might apply such "persist tags"/"clear tags" rules could be:

- After batch convert
- After batch rename
- After copy/move (tags persist or not at destination)
- On exit folder
I've added persistent tags for next release, but having such rules seems to me a little more complicated. Perhaps only clear after operation (copy/move/convert/rename) or "at exit" or never
Once we have persistent tags, we'll need a "clear all tags", "clear all tags in folder", "clear all tags in folder tree" , etc.
"clear all tags" & "clear all current tags" is enough for me
Furthermore, we need a method to tag folders.
Why?
as persistent tags, but IMHO XnView's Category (and Rating) implementation is cumbersome and inconvenient to use. I'd much prefer
Really?? The current implementation is not good???
Pierre.

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Post by xnview » Tue Feb 19, 2008 1:58 pm

fbachofner wrote: If XNView adopted a similar method of dealing with tags, it would be the perfect image management solution!
Where in polyview, i can't find it???
Pierre.

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JohnFredC
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Post by JohnFredC » Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:09 pm

Hi Pierre
xnview wrote:I've added persistent tags for next release, but having such rules seems to me a little more complicated. Perhaps only clear after operation (copy/move/convert/rename) or "at exit" or never
Great! That's at least a start!
Furthermore, we need a method to tag folders.
Tagging folders would simplify some forms of image management. Instead of entering every folder and tagging all of its images, I could just tag the folder itself, then when operations on tags happen, all contents of the folder would automatically participate.
but IMHO XnView's Category (and Rating) implementation is cumbersome and inconvenient to use.
Really?? The current implementation is not good???
I'm sorry Pierre, but IMHO it doesn't go far enough...

There are two basic activities related to Category and Ratings: 1) Assignment 2) Display.

Display

For me, using the tree to Display Category/Rating memberships works fine. It is also adequate for maintaining categories with one exception:

Once you have displayed a Category of images (by clicking the checkbox), it is impossible to return to the previous display mode. The "go back" button on the mini-tool bar should take you back from Category display to whatever was the previous view.

Assignment

The only means of Assignment are drag-and-drop and the Ratings/Color Context submenu. This implementation means that one has to display the side panel to make Category assignments and cannot make assignments in the Viewer at all.

Categories/Ratings should have some means of direct assignment from anywhere in XnView!

I have lots of ideas that might work: Category/Rating combo box in the toolbars. Interactive stars directly in the thumbnails. Popup up dialog with Category tree from a clickable control in the thumbnail, or from a button on the toolbars. Combo box directly in thumbnail (that appears only on mouse-over). Make current Category panel "tear-off" and floating. Etc.

Also, Category/Rating/Color assignments should be available as a separate tab in the Batch dialog...

Users. Never satisfied. 8)
John

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Post by fbachofner » Tue Feb 19, 2008 5:31 pm

Hi Pierre:
xnview wrote:Where in polyview, i can't find it???
1. Make a slideshow, for example.
2. Press spacebar to mark images.
3. Exit slideshow.
4. Click on BROWSE menu, Browse Marked Images

The same functionality exists from anywhere else you can tag (i.e. "mark," in Polyview's lingo) images -- such as the image browser.

The marked images PERSIST until either:
1. you remove them from the marked folder (just UNmark them with spacebar -- or delete the ACTUAL file, *careful*)

2. you exit the application


One of the great features of the marked images "virtual folder" is that you can easily apply operations over files from a great MANY actual folders in ONE operation. For example: put them in a slideshow, COPY or MOVE files from multiple folders into ONE folder (very useful for organization).

Please let me know whether you need any more input. Thanks for your great product XNView!

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Post by xnview » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:44 pm

fbachofner wrote: One of the great features of the marked images "virtual folder" is that you can easily apply operations over files from a great MANY actual folders in ONE operation. For example: put them in a slideshow, COPY or MOVE files from multiple folders into ONE folder (very useful for organization).
Ok.

So we need "clear all tags" & "clear all current tags"
And setting for tag, clear after operation/clear at exit/Never

Is it good?
Pierre.

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Post by JohnFredC » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:18 pm

xnview wrote:So we need "clear all tags" & "clear all current tags"
And setting for tag, clear after operation/clear at exit/Never

Is it good?
Yes. Very good!

But... what is a "current" tag? Is it local to the current folder?
John

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Post by xnview » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:26 pm

JohnFredC wrote: But... what is a "current" tag? Is it local to the current folder?
Yes tag in current folder
Pierre.

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Post by JohnFredC » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:49 pm

That's a good idea. The current folder determines what are "temporary" (ie. "current") tags.

But, now, how to define "folder"? Do you really mean "view"? Such as the currently selected category or rating?

I think "current" should apply to the current view, not only the current folder.
John

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Post by xnview » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:50 pm

JohnFredC wrote:That's a good idea. The current folder determines what are "temporary" (ie. "current") tags.

But, now, how to define "folder"? Do you really mean "view"? Such as the currently selected category or rating?

I think "current" should apply to the current view, not only the current folder.
Sorry i means current view (folder, search result, ....)
Pierre.

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Post by Dreamer » Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:09 am

Dreamer wrote:Another minor suggestion:

- Option to go to the next item after selecting(tagging) (to quickly tag more items)
Any chance for this small option in the next version - at least the ini option?? It would be very useful when I need to select many images, e.g. first 6 images, then skip one and select 5, skip 2, select 4... It would be very easy with just to keys - Space and Right arrow with this option. If you're using file manager, you know what I'm talking about (Insert works like this by default I guess).

Perhaps two ini options, for Space and for Insert.

Thanks.
Dreamer

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