Second Browser/File List Window

Ideas for improvements and requests for new features in XnView Classic

Moderators: XnTriq, xnview

Do You want Second Browser Window ?

Yes
8
28%
Yes, but with ability to display folder tree too (next to preview)
14
48%
No
7
24%
 
Total votes: 29

User avatar
Dreamer
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Second Browser/File List Window

Post by Dreamer » Fri Aug 13, 2004 1:35 pm

Update:

I want just another mode/layout with two file lists, two previews and file manager's hotkeys - Tab, F5 ,F6 and Insert/Space - other hotkeys works already in xnview (F2, F3, F4, F7, DEL, Shift+DEL...).

Code: Select all

+--------+---------+--------+---------+
|        |         |        |         |
| folder | preview | folder | preview |
|  tree  |         |  tree  |         |
|        |         |        |         |
+--------+---------+--------+---------+
|    image1.jpg    |    image5.jpg    |
|    image2.jpg    |    image6.jpg    |
|    image3.jpg    |    image7.jpg    |
|    image4.jpg    |    image8.jpg    |
+------------------+------------------+
[/color]

This layout could have its own size/position.
I don't want any special file manager's features.

Main advantages:

- you could copy/move files easily as in file managers with F5/F6
- you could see preview of images you want copy/move (impossible in file managers)
- you could see details of several images in different folders at once
- no need to move and resize two instances of xnview and then move and resize back
- no need to switch between two instances of xnview (and other opened windows) with alt+tab

It would be the same as current "Tab" feature, just switching would be with Tab key and it would be in the same window.

Copy/Move F5/F6 features would be the same as current "Copy to/Move to" features, just target directory would be always directory in other file list on the other side.



I've got 1 suggestion - add second browser window, with ability to copy and move with drag&drop and hotkeys F5, F6 and Tab for change browser window like in Total Commander for example

It could be like this:

+--XnView----------------------+
| . Tool Bar . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
+---------------------------------+
| . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
| . . . . preview window . . . .|
| . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . |
+----------------+---------------+
| . . . . . . . . . . | . . . . . . . . . . |
| . browser1 . | . browser2 . |
| . . . . . . . . . . | . . . . . . . . . . |
+----------------+---------------+
Last edited by Dreamer on Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:00 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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helmut
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Location: Frankfurt, Germany

Re: Second browser window

Post by helmut » Sat Aug 14, 2004 8:47 am

Dreamer wrote:I've got 1 suggestion - add second browser window, with ability to copy and move with drag&drop and hotkeys F5, F6 and Tab for change browser window like in Total Commander for example
...
Thank you for your suggestion. Now that more and more people have more and more images on their computer, I understand the need for file management functionality.

Two comments:

a.) Currently, there's important basic file management functionality missing in XnView. These are: Moving and copying folders in the file list, and the actions "Create folder", "Copy folder", and "Move folder" in the folder tree (see Renaming and deleting folders for example). This should have prio 1 and be addressed, soon.

b.) XnView should provide file management functionality (see a.), but must not compete with file managers or become a file manager.

I'd be interested to know what other people think about this.

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Dreamer
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Re: Second browser window

Post by Dreamer » Sat Aug 14, 2004 1:14 pm

helmut wrote:I'd be interested to know what other people think about this.
So, could I add poll question for this :?:
helmut wrote:b.) XnView should provide file management functionality (see a.), but must not compete with file managers or become a file manager.
Already now XnView's got 2 "browsers" - 1 browser and 1 folder tree, so I just think that it would be better to have 2 "normal" browsers with easier and quicker navigation (than drag&drop to folder tree)

Many users have got 2 XnView windows opened at once and uses drag&drop for moving and copying images, so I think this would be better way...

I don't want that XnView compete with file managers or even become a file manager. File managers have got many other "non image" features and XnView many "image" features, so I don't think that this would changes XnView to file manager.

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helmut
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Re: Second browser window

Post by helmut » Sat Aug 14, 2004 9:19 pm

Dreamer wrote:
helmut wrote:I'd be interested to know what other people think about this.
So, could I add poll question for this :?:
In the past, only few people have joined the polls, this is why I prefer to have direct user feedback and pros and cons at the moment. Sure enough, you can start a poll or you can let me know and I can convert this topic into a poll.
Dreamer wrote:
helmut wrote:b.) XnView should provide file management functionality (see a.), but must not compete with file managers or become a file manager.
Already now XnView's got 2 "browsers" - 1 browser and 1 folder tree, so I just think that it would be better to have 2 "normal" browsers with easier and quicker navigation (than drag&drop to folder tree)
If I get you right, the list of files is one complete browser. So in the "file management layout", you don't need the folder tree at all?
Dreamer wrote:Many users have got 2 XnView windows opened at once and uses drag&drop for moving and copying images, so I think this would be better way...
Personally I open the Explorer for copying and moving files. You're sure that many people work with two instances of XnView opened?
Dreamer wrote:I don't want that XnView compete with file managers or even become a file manager. File managers have got many other "non image" features and XnView many "image" features, so I don't think that this would changes XnView to file manager.
We both agree here.

In your inital post, there's a nice layout drawing with preview on the top of the main window. Is this on purpose? What's the advantage? Shouldn't there be two layouts, one with the preview at top, one at the bottom?

So all in all the main window could look like this:

Code: Select all

+-------------------------------+
|               |               |
|  File list 1  |  File list 2  |
|               |               |
+---------------+---------------+
|                               |
|            Preview            |
|                               |
+-------------------------------+
Last edited by helmut on Fri May 16, 2008 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Dreamer
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Post by Dreamer » Sun Aug 15, 2004 7:18 pm

helmut wrote:If I get you right, the list of files is one complete browser.
Yes, browser is the list of files without folder tree.
helmut wrote:So in the "file management layout", you don't need the folder tree at all?
No, I don't use the folder tree at all, I prefer navigation with keyboard (arrows, enter, ctrl+x, ctrl+c, ctrl+v...), I think it's much quicker.
helmut wrote:In your inital post, there's a nice layout drawing with preview on the top of the main window. Is this on purpose?
Yes, I prefer preview on the top of the main window, but under the toolbar
helmut wrote:What's the advantage?
It's habit only, I used like that
helmut wrote:Shouldn't there be two layouts, one with the preview at top, one at the bottom?
Yes, definitely and current layouts (under view-layout) should stay

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helmut
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Post by helmut » Tue Aug 17, 2004 7:24 pm

There are many things to take into account when having two panes each with a file list (I don't want to use the term 'browser', here, since the XnView browser is the whole main window with all the panes):

E.g. each file list needs its own address list and the little toolbar (for creating, renaming and deleting folders). You have to make sure that it is clear which pane and files the menu items should affect. Also, if there still should be a folder tree, you surely need one tree for each file list. The result would be something like:

Code: Select all

+--------+--------+--------+--------+
|Folder  | File   |Folder  | File   |
|tree 1  | list 1 |tree 2  | list 2 |
|        |        |        |        |
+--------+--------+--------+--------+
|                                   |
|            Preview                |
|                                   |
+-----------------------------------+
From my point of view the usage and user interface would be too complicated and could be used with very large screen resolutions, only. So I like the idea but I'd rather have a good integration with existing file managers like Total Commander and other than including this into XnView.

Apart from the user level/perspective, there's the technical level, which can be answered by Pierre, only. But I guess that introducing two file lists would be a real big effort and change in XnView.

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Dreamer
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Post by Dreamer » Tue Aug 17, 2004 10:54 pm

helmut wrote:

Code: Select all

+--------+--------+--------+--------+
|Folder  | File   |Folder  | File   |
|tree 1  | list 1 |tree 2  | list 2 |
|        |        |        |        |
+--------+--------+--------+--------+
|                                   |
|            Preview                |
|                                   |
+-----------------------------------+
From my point of view the usage and user interface would be too complicated and could be used with very large screen resolutions, only. So I like the idea but I'd rather have a good integration with existing file managers like Total Commander and other than including this into XnView.
And this?

Code: Select all

+---------------------------------------+
|                preview                |
+-------------------+-------------------+
|  folder tree 1    |  folder tree 2    |
+-------------------+-------------------+
|  file list 1      |  file list 2      |
+-------------------+-------------------+
But you don't need folder tree at all, if you've got two file lists.

Main advantage of 2 browsers/file lists is that you can see what and where you're going to copy/move and that you can see preview image.

Main disadvantage of file managers like Total Commander is that you can't see preview image, and this is the main reason why I want 2 browsers/file lists in XnView
helmut wrote:Apart from the user level/perspective, there's the technical level, which can be answered by Pierre, only.
Of course :)
helmut wrote:But I guess that introducing two file lists would be a real big effort and change in XnView.
I don't want it soon, (there are more important things) maybe some other people (and Pierre :wink: ) could tell their position, suggestions...

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SeaMaiden
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Post by SeaMaiden » Wed Aug 18, 2004 12:30 pm

The ability to view a second browser window (with or without a second file tree) should be an optional setting that the user can configure.

User should be able to customize how their browser window (or windows) work in XnView, just as they can now, and they need individual settings for each window/tree.

EXAMPLE #1

- 1 browser window open
*without a tree

- 1 browser window open
* with a tree

- 2 browser windows open
* 1 with a tree/ 1 without a tree

- 2 browser windows open
* both with trees

- 2 browser windows open
* both without trees

In addition, user should be able to customize colors for each window and tree individually, as well as colors/fonts for all browser components. Do not force multiple browser settings to be global so that user would have no choice but to view both windows/tree(s) with the same colors & fonts.

Let user be able to view each one in different colors, fonts, etc. XnView currently has only one browser window. User can configure all these components for that window. In a multi-window option, the user needs to be able to configure each thing individually as well.

EXAMPLE #2
(both browser windows are in thumbnail view)

- Browser Window #1: Local drive
* colors: blue/yellow
* font: Times New Roman, 11pt Bold, Dark Blue

- Browser Window #2: Network drive
* colors: green/yellow
* font: Rockwell, 11pt Bold Italic, Maroon


EXAMPLE #3
(one window is in thumbnail view & other window is in icon view)

- Browser Window #1: Local drive C
* view as thumbnail
* colors: blue/yellow
* font: Arial Narrow, 12 pt, Black

- Browser Windows #2: Local drive G
* view as icons

In this manner, the user never gets confused which window refers to which drive.

Let the user be able to choose all the colors/fonts individually for each browser, as well as whether to view each as icons or as thumbnails. Without this capability, both browser windows will always look the same. The ability to view one browser as thumbnails and the other browser as icons is a must. Allow preview images to work in both windows as well.

Also, these settings should NOT reset automatically when you close the browsers and reopen them, or when you close XnView and reopen it.

If XnView is to have multiple windows, then let user be able to express their individuality for each.

Thank you.

Terri

--------------------------

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JohnFredC
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Post by JohnFredC » Thu Aug 19, 2004 2:45 pm

Main disadvantage of file managers like Total Commander is that you can't see preview image
This is patently not true. TotalCommander supports more plugins (including image plugins) than any other file manager.

Try installing one of the many TC image viewer plugins, then select an image file in the file list and press ctrl-q.

TC doesn't support native thumbnailing yet (promised for v6.5), but there is a plugin already available that displays thumbnails using the Windows Explorer control...

Other side-by-side file managers that do show thumbnails include SpeedCommander, DOpus, Servant Salamander, Frigate, FreeCommander, and many others.
John

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Dreamer
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Post by Dreamer » Thu Aug 19, 2004 5:02 pm

JohnFredC wrote:
Main disadvantage of file managers like Total Commander is that you can't see preview image
This is patently not true...

...Other side-by-side file managers that do show thumbnails include SpeedCommander, DOpus, Servant Salamander, Frigate, FreeCommander, and many others.
But I did't meant "thumbnails", I meant preview image

I'm using Servant Salamander - I can see preview image there, but only after pressing F3, then Escape and so on...

I need to see preview image always, while I copy/move... images, like this

Code: Select all

+---------------------------------------+ 
|                                       | 
|                preview                | 
|                                       | 
+-------------------+-------------------+ 
|  image1.jpg       |  image5.jpg       | 
|  image2.jpg       |  image6.jpg       | 
|  image3.jpg       |  image7.jpg       | 
|  image4.jpg       |  image8.jpg       | 
+-------------------+-------------------+
Any (freeware) program knows that :?:

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JohnFredC
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Post by JohnFredC » Thu Aug 19, 2004 5:15 pm

(2Dreamer Sorry, I misunderstood you. :? )

The following arrangement would be very useful to me.

Code: Select all

+---------------------------------------+ 
|                   |                   | 
|      preview      |     preview       | 
|                   |                   | 
+-------------------+-------------------+ 
|  image1.jpg       |  image5.jpg       | 
|  image2.jpg       |  image6.jpg       | 
|  image3.jpg       |  image7.jpg       | 
|  image4.jpg       |  image8.jpg       | 
+-------------------+-------------------+ 
Each side a different folder if desired...
John

Guest

Post by Guest » Thu Sep 02, 2004 2:18 am

Code: Select all

+---------+---------------+---------------+ 
|         |               |               | 
| folder  |     preview   |    preview    | 
| tree    |               |               | 
|         +---------------+---------------+ 
|         |  image1.jpg   |  image5.jpg   | 
|         |  image2.jpg   |  image6.jpg   | 
|         |  image3.jpg   |  image7.jpg   | 
|         |  image4.jpg   |  image8.jpg   | 
+---------+---------------+---------------+
It would be useful to have an optional folder tree view, common for the two panes.

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JohnFredC
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Post by JohnFredC » Thu Sep 02, 2004 2:35 am

I really dislike the 1 folder-tree style... Dopus uses that and a few others. Things jump around too much when you navigate the file lists.

Give me two trees, instead...

Actually, two independent XNViews side by side is just the ticket. I can do that now except it is a pain to arrange the views by hand (er, mouse). Perhaps some form of layout control over individually running copies of XNView would be a better solution. Then everyone could each have their own "special" layouts containing as many trees, previews, etc, as they wish.

Hmmm.
John

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helmut
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Post by helmut » Thu Sep 02, 2004 8:15 pm

JohnFredC wrote:I really dislike the 1 folder-tree style... Dopus uses that and a few others. Things jump around too much when you navigate the file lists.

Give me two trees, instead...
I strongly agree. One preview and one folder tree per file list. In my opinion, this is the only way to keep things simple.
JohnFredC wrote:Actually, two independent XNViews side by side is just the ticket. ...
I also think that several instances is the way to go.
A suggestion to improve the handing: In the folder tree, there could be a context menu which allows for opening a second instance with the file list opened on the selected directory (Similar to the menu item "Explorer" in the context menu of Windows Explorer on Windows 2000 and Windows XP).

Guest

Post by Guest » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:12 pm

JohnFredC wrote:I really dislike the 1 folder-tree style... Dopus uses that and a few others. Things jump around too much when you navigate the file lists.

Give me two trees, instead...
It really does not have to jump around. Filequest has this single tree/many folder panes arrangement and I have been using it for a long time without problems. For instance, if you click on one folder in the tree it opens in a new pane, but the number of open panes can be limited by the user. I typically use 3. If I already have three panes open and click on a folder, it opens in the last active pane, replacing the display that was there.
If in an open folder pane you click on a subfolder, then the tree expands to show that subfolder. If this is where you say that it jumps around, maybe an option to block this behaviour would solve the problem.
Multiple tree panes might be a good idea, but they use up too much screen space for my taste, although I do have a 20' display.
I have never used Dopus, which you say you dislike, but you may want to try Filequest, I think it had a 60 day trial period the last time I checked.

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