Batch Rename with Tabs

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Dreamer
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Batch Rename with Tabs

Post by Dreamer » Tue Nov 15, 2005 12:47 am

<Moderator's note: This topic has been split from another topic>
helmut wrote: - Using Tabs
Currently there are discussion regarding the usage of "Tabs" in the "Batch Convert" dialog, see topic "Save As" for Browser vs. Batch Convert for details. The "Batch Rename" dialog has become very full and I wonder whether it's time to introduce tabs here, too. There could be a main tab with all the settings needed per rename session, and on a seperate tab all the options like handling of name clashes and settings when opening the dialog.
I disagree. I think it would be confusing, some options could be enabled in second tab, user can't see it and he could rename images with these options.

E.g. if you'd use option "Replace/With" for 1000 images by accident, it could be very hard/impossible to undo this.

We could rather split some options, make new dialog/hotkey, but I think it's not needed, I like the way it is now.

XnView 1.82 alpha
Last edited by Dreamer on Mon Feb 20, 2006 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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helmut
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Re: Batch Rename: "Duplicate" dialog

Post by helmut » Fri Nov 18, 2005 6:31 pm

Dreamer wrote:
helmut wrote: - Using Tabs
Currently there are discussion regarding the usage of "Tabs" in the "Batch Convert" dialog, see topic "Save As" for Browser vs. Batch Convert for details. The "Batch Rename" dialog has become very full and I wonder whether it's time to introduce tabs here, too. There could be a main tab with all the settings needed per rename session, and on a seperate tab all the options like handling of name clashes and settings when opening the dialog.
I disagree. I think it would be confusing, some options could be enabled in second tab, user can't see it and he could rename images with these options.

E.g. if you'd use option "Replace/With" for 1000 images by accident, it could be very hard/impossible to undo this.

We could rather split some options, make new dialog/hotkey, but I think it's not needed, I like the way it is now.
I understand your point, but there are options in "Duplicate..." sub dialog - you will not see any of these, either.

I think the "Duplicate..." button is a simple, but bad way to enhance the crowded "Batch Rename" dialog. As you can see in the discussion in Batch Rename, tabs can turn out to be a better alternative.

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Post by Dreamer » Sat Nov 19, 2005 1:18 am

I think all options on other tabs must be disabled (otherwise, you'd need to check if it's enabled or disabled or you'd apply it by accident) - and then it would be much less usable when a user wants to use it again and again. Therefore I don't like tabs in single option dialogs. I think it's good now, later we could move one big option to other/new dialog.

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Post by helmut » Sat Nov 19, 2005 11:30 am

Dreamer wrote:I think all options on other tabs must be disabled (otherwise, you'd need to check if it's enabled or disabled or you'd apply it by accident) - and then it would be much less usable when a user wants to use it again and again. Therefore I don't like tabs in single option dialogs. I think it's good now, later we could move one big option to other/new dialog.
I understand your point, but again: Currently you have no idea what the settings in Duplicate sub dialog are, unless you open the sub dialog.

The tabs are no cure for everything, but I think they can help if dialogs are too crowded (i.e., have many, many controls on it). For experienced users crowded dialogs are good since they can be controled very quickly, but for novices and many users it's very confusing.

First, the original dialog in 1.82 Alpha
Image

I've made a draft to show what tabs could look like and for further discussion:

#HM1-a: Batch Rename with Tabs - Page 'Filename'
Image

#HM1-b: Page 'Replace'
Image

#HM1-c: Page 'Duplicates'
Image

Notes:
- If a tab has an active action, an exclamation mark "!" is shown in the title of the appropriate tab. This way the user can quickly see whether an action in a tab is active or not.

- The controls on 'Duplicate' tab differ from the sub dialog in the 1.82 alpha, this is on purpose, see discussion in topic Batch Rename: "Duplicate" dialog

- The 'Options' tab is for option "Create new template when opening dialog".

As you can see, the dialog design becomes very clear when using tabs. Also, the actions applied on filenames (Filename, Replace, Duplicates) are a sort of production line: First, filenames are changed. Second, string replacements are done. And third, duplicate filenames are avoided by adding suffixes if needed. The tab approach reflects this "production line" very well and the user gets a good idea what's happening behind the scenes, which is important to use the dialog properly.

Most users will use tab 'Filename'. 'Replace' tab can be important, too. Tabs 'Duplicate' and 'Options' are rarely used and basically 'Set once and then forget' settings.

It's many tabs, yes, and power users might find the tabs too clumsy, but think about it and you might also find this approach useful.

Comments and feedback (Pro & Con) are welcome (as always).

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Post by Dreamer » Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:22 am

helmut wrote:...#HM1-a: Batch Rename with Tabs - Page 'Filename'
Image
...
NEVER! :wink: I very strongly disagree!
It's many tabs, yes, and power users might find the tabs too clumsy, but think about it and you might also find this approach useful.
I think it would be much more confusing for normal and advanced users. You'd must always check the other tabs, what is enabled, what values are set there and you could forget, then must check it again and - you could apply wrong option by accident very easy though!
- If a tab has an active action, an exclamation mark "!" is shown in the title of the appropriate tab. This way the user can quickly see whether an action in a tab is active or not.
Do you really mean this '!' would be less confusing?? It's even not a standard and you don't like such things.

Now, disabled options are all completely greyed out, so users clearly see that these options are disables and will not be applied.
Tabs 'Duplicate' and 'Options' are rarely used and basically 'Set once and then forget' settings.
Therefore they don't deserve own tab. They could be only/also in main Options window (F12), and in Rename dialog could be just one button "Options" or "More options" that would open normal Options dialog, same as in Convert dialog.

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Post by Olivier_G » Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:08 pm

helmut wrote:The tabs are no cure for everything, but I think they can help if dialogs are too crowded (i.e., have many, many controls on it).
I agree on this point. However, I think that it is not the case yet for Batch Rename... and that tabs are not really an improvement here.

My guess is that some optimization of the current options and layout on the same panel would be enough (and better, which is even more important).

Olivier

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Post by helmut » Thu Nov 24, 2005 10:13 pm

Thank you, Dreamer and Olivier for your feedbacks. My solution really seems to be "overtabbed". ;-)

The situation has not changed: Screen design of Batch Rename really needs some changes. Putting the "Duplicate" stuff and the option "Create new template when opening dialog" on one or two separate tasb or in the option dialog should be done. Not sure which one is better - anything is better than the way it is now.

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Post by Dreamer » Fri Nov 25, 2005 12:43 am

helmut wrote:Thank you, Dreamer and Olivier for your feedbacks. My solution really seems to be "overtabbed". ;-)

The situation has not changed: Screen design of Batch Rename really needs some changes. Putting the "Duplicate" stuff and the option "Create new template when opening dialog" on one or two separate tasb or in the option dialog should be done. Not sure which one is better - anything is better than the way it is now.
What about move it to Options dialog and add one button (Options) to Batch rename dialog (with the focus to these options - duplicate...) - same as Batch rename (Format Options)? We could add more options then and it would be clearer than two tabs. Users could set it when they browse/change all settings. I think all such settings should be in main Options dialog, or at least as many as possible.

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Post by helmut » Fri Nov 25, 2005 12:47 am

Dreamer wrote:...
What about move it to Options dialog and add one button (Options) to Batch rename dialog (with the focus to these options - duplicate...) - same as Batch rename (Format Options)? We could add more options then and it would be clearer than two tabs. Users could set it when they browse/change all settings. I think all such settings should be in main Options dialog, or at least as many as possible.
Yes, that's a possible way to go (you have suggested this in your previous post, already). I'll think about it a bit more. Other ideas & opinions are welcome.

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